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NNadir

(38,016 posts)
32. Again, the question is, did radioactivity from nuclear power plants kill as many people in 70 years as died in the...
Sat Mar 28, 2026, 09:41 PM
16 hrs ago

...last ten hours from air pollution?

I am aware of paranoid reactions to radiation, (which I think illiterate) but every living thing on this planet is breathing, inescapably fossil fuel waste.

Nuclear energy need not be risk free to be vastly superior to everything else. It only needs to be superior to everything else, which, in fact, it is.

I am really not impressed by someone's particular paranoia about subjects about which they know basically zero, the components of nuclear fuel, its chemistry, its physics, and its value.

If, taking a break from whining about used nuclear fuel storage, which exhibits a spectacular record - unlike coal plants - of not killing anyone ever in this country, please indicate a case where this statement is wrong. Show that there is an incidence of a fatality from said storage in this country. Please provide it, but I will accept only papers from the legitimate primary scientific literature as evidence.

I argue that the ability to contain the products of energy production on the site where it is created is a huge advantage compared to everything else. Show me I'm wrong.

As for the bullshit about 40,000 years, sometimes one million years, sometimes five million years, six hundred thousand years, I hear it all the time from people who have not a clue about the components of used nuclear fuel, its chemistry, its physics, the lifetime of its components while ignoring its enormous ability to save human lives and the lives of all living things. I am familiar with pretty much every isotope present in used nuclear fuel. Please feel free to enlighten me to which of them this 40,000 year figure applies.

Like all the numbers pulled out the hats of antinukes, these numbers strike me as nonsense. In any case, the half life of lead and mercury spewed from coal plants in infinite, and not contained anywhere but strictly dumped in aerosols. These are profound neurotoxins. In fact, I sometimes wonder whether these fossil fuel contaminants account for the rise of ignorance and its tragic consequences leading to the rising decline of humanity, and in fact, many other living things.

For the record, a radioactive isotope of the essential element, potassium, 40K is in every living thing. It has a half-life of over 1.2 billion years, and without its presence life is impossible.

As for the major component of used nuclear fuel, uranium, it has been on the planet for its entire history. There are over 4.5 billion tons of it in the ocean alone. It's in every granite countertop found any kitchen having granite, along with its radioactive decay products.

When addressing antinukes and their pernicious and deadly rhetoric often cite this paper coauthored by one of the world's leading climate scientists:

Prevented Mortality and Greenhouse Gas Emissions from Historical and Projected Nuclear Power (Pushker A. Kharecha* and James E. Hansen Environ. Sci. Technol., 2013, 47 (9), pp 4889–4895)

Nuclear energy saves lives. Here, for reference, is some text that I keep handy is how many people are killed by antinuke rhetoric:

Global burden of 87 risk factors in 204 countries and territories, 1990–2019: a systematic analysis for the Global Burden of Disease Study 2019 (Lancet Volume 396, Issue 10258, 17–23 October 2020, Pages 1223-1249). This study is a huge undertaking and the list of authors from around the world is rather long. These studies are always open sourced; and I invite people who want to carry on about Fukushima to open it and search the word "radiation." It appears once. Radon, a side product brought to the surface by fracking while we all wait for the grand so called "renewable energy" nirvana that did not come, is not here and won't come, appears however: Household radon, from the decay of natural uranium, which has been cycling through the environment ever since oxygen appeared in the Earth's atmosphere.

Here is what it says about air pollution deaths in the 2019 Global Burden of Disease Survey, if one is too busy to open it oneself because one is too busy carrying on about Fukushima:

The top five risks for attributable deaths for females were high SBP (5·25 million [95% UI 4·49–6·00] deaths, or 20·3% [17·5–22·9] of all female deaths in 2019), dietary risks (3·48 million [2·78–4·37] deaths, or 13·5% [10·8–16·7] of all female deaths in 2019), high FPG (3·09 million [2·40–3·98] deaths, or 11·9% [9·4–15·3] of all female deaths in 2019), air pollution (2·92 million [2·53–3·33] deaths or 11·3% [10·0–12·6] of all female deaths in 2019), and high BMI (2·54 million [1·68–3·56] deaths or 9·8% [6·5–13·7] of all female deaths in 2019). For males, the top five risks differed slightly. In 2019, the leading Level 2 risk factor for attributable deaths globally in males was tobacco (smoked, second-hand, and chewing), which accounted for 6·56 million (95% UI 6·02–7·10) deaths (21·4% [20·5–22·3] of all male deaths in 2019), followed by high SBP, which accounted for 5·60 million (4·90–6·29) deaths (18·2% [16·2–20·1] of all male deaths in 2019). The third largest Level 2 risk factor for attributable deaths among males in 2019 was dietary risks (4·47 million [3·65–5·45] deaths, or 14·6% [12·0–17·6] of all male deaths in 2019) followed by air pollution (ambient particulate matter and ambient ozone pollution, accounting for 3·75 million [3·31–4·24] deaths (12·2% [11·0–13·4] of all male deaths in 2019), and then high FPG (3·14 million [2·70–4·34] deaths, or 11·1% [8·9–14·1] of all male deaths in 2019).


Antinuke paranoia kills people, about 19,000 every day.

We have been collecting valuable used nuclear fuel for 70 years in this country. Again and again and again: When did used nuclear fuel, stored on site where generated, kill half as much as what antinuke rhetoric killed since midnight last night from fossil fuel waste?

I would suggest opening a science book, but I seldom see an antinuke who shows any evidence of having opened one.

As for the claimed distance of 40 miles, let me know where I can go on this planet to not breathe fossil fuel waste. It's in my lungs right now, and I hold antinukes responsible for this state of affairs. There is nowhere on the planet I can go to escape it. I hold antinukes responsible for a burning planet, extreme weather, and a thousand unnatural shocks to which the planet is heir to well beyond the people killed by air pollution.

Frankly I liked the honesty better than the dodge: All antinukes are defending coal, gas, and petroleum, substances rapidly destroying the planet's major ecosystems. There are no exceptions.

If I sound angry, it may be because I am.

Have a nice Sunday tomorrow.

Recommendations

1 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

We may not need any stinking oil after all.. [View all] multigraincracker Yesterday OP
Someone please explain how this doesn't break the first law of thermodynamics. harumph Yesterday #1
it is harnessing a 'second' source of energy, in addition to the solar stopdiggin Yesterday #2
Not if it's harnessing solar power, which is infinite as long as we have a source FakeNoose Yesterday #7
'solar power' doesn't do anything like 'revising' thermodynamics ... stopdiggin 18 hrs ago #30
I have no science background Eddie Haskell 60 Yesterday #9
No, that is thermodynamics. mr715 Yesterday #18
cool Eddie Haskell 60 Yesterday #21
I'm not buying any of this. To start with, there is no such thing as 100% efficency in any realm. flashman13 Yesterday #12
The 130% number being bandied about in the article refers to quantum efficiency Shermann Yesterday #16
I am always raising my eyebrows James48 Yesterday #3
Why? mr715 Yesterday #19
It isn't 130% efficient if it is 2 energy harvesting events. mr715 Yesterday #4
I discussed this badly misinterpreted wishful thinking case in another thread on the topic. NNadir Yesterday #5
No angrychair Yesterday #6
Mercury in the exhaust smoke. BidenRocks Yesterday #8
That is appalling and dangerous nonsense. When confronted... NNadir Yesterday #10
I was just using it as an example angrychair 21 hrs ago #28
Again, the question is, did radioactivity from nuclear power plants kill as many people in 70 years as died in the... NNadir 16 hrs ago #32
So by your logic angrychair 14 hrs ago #33
poster said absolutely nothing of the sort stopdiggin 1 hr ago #39
After coal is burned fly ash has to be disposed of. What goes into the air stays in the air. twodogsbarking Yesterday #11
Coal ash has radioactivity and heavy metals IbogaProject Yesterday #14
More people have died in coal processing, burning than nuclear. mr715 Yesterday #15
Nonsense Disaffected 23 hrs ago #24
Coal's main byproduct is CO2 NickB79 20 hrs ago #29
you could not be more completely misinformed - or wrong about a particular subject. stopdiggin 17 hrs ago #31
Hanford angrychair 14 hrs ago #34
Trade offs for any decision. mr715 12 hrs ago #37
No. They do not. (say differently) stopdiggin 1 hr ago #38
Isn't this a peer review journal? multigraincracker Yesterday #13
Its a popsci distillation. mr715 Yesterday #17
No. I accessed the paper on which this pop misinformation is based. NNadir 23 hrs ago #23
It's not a perpetual motion machine swong19104 Yesterday #20
Link to the actual scientific paper mentioned in the press report JHB Yesterday #22
The paper if not talking about energy conversion efficiency. Disaffected 23 hrs ago #25
Wait!?! H2O Man 23 hrs ago #27
Recommended. H2O Man 23 hrs ago #26
Violates the first Law of Thermodynamics Smells like BS Melon 13 hrs ago #35
Whatever bankrupts the wretched Saudi oligarchs, the better! Initech 13 hrs ago #36
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