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Sailingfish

(47 posts)
49. Forgive the intrusion. Hope you don't mind.
Wed Jan 22, 2025, 06:06 PM
Jan 2025
Somehow, we need a shift so that red v. blue is focused primarily on economics. I don't know how we do it or I wouldn't be looking for ideas here. But I think we need to somehow get there. Others may not see it that way, but that's where I'm at. The billionaires are literally killing us, they are not afraid of us, they've got us split. If we could somehow work on that and descend on Washington with a national strike, perhaps that could move the needle.

Spot on with that. Allow me an opinion and it won't be a very popular one. The left populist part of Bernie's platform can get traction. Taking on billionaires, wealth inequality, healthcare, taking on the establishment and elites, labor issues, Social Security. All that resonates far beyond the Democratic Party and is something to work with. The progressive part of Bernie's platform will not get traction and is one of the reasons the Democratic Party lost the election. I've no doubt that Sanders and the progressives were in Biden's ear for four years in shaping progressive climate policy. It's true there was a shift from Neoliberalism but it's irrelevant because the result was worse.

Progressive environmentalism within a capitalist framework is a recipe for unyielding authoritarianism and austerity for labor, the working class, and the poor. A new New Deal could of got traction. A "Green New Deal" will not. Progressive environmentalism is, and always has been a movement of upper-middle class bloviators who can afford the repercussions of the policy prescriptions they preach. They can look very similar to the policy prescriptions of ecofascists. Climate science has become a religion that will tolerate no dissent or reason. Climate doom and fearmongering is not a bug. It's a well planned propaganda feature of the movement that has no basis in scientific reality. Whistleblowers within the movement abound that prove it. That's not climate denial. That's fact. Bernie and progressives are as guilty of that, as are Paul Ehrlich and his overpopulation disciples who bear resemblance to Malthus at his worst. Ehrlich was proven to be full of shit. As a labor leftist I've been dealing with this unadulterated overpopulation and climate doom bullshit for over two decades with no result. There is no "climate catastrophe" and no "sixth mass extinction" being caused by a couple hundred years of industrial civilization. Extinctions are assured. The nature of the universe is violent on an unimaginable scale. Planets and stars die every second of every day. People thinking they can step outside of and control nature is the true denial. A ten mile asteroid smashing this planet is catastrophic climate change. A few hundred years of industrial civilization not so much.

The environmental policies prescribed by the current Democratic Party are an unmitigated disaster that have caused rampant inflation and driven the costs of daily survival through the roof. The upper 10-20% can afford to withstand the pain. The rest of the population can't. All of it is about a lot more than the "price of eggs" that detached from reality Democrats have pulled out of their ass as a meme to disparage and marginalize anyone unhappy with the cost of daily survival, regardless of political affiliation.

There was a thread here a spell ago about how high gas prices and inflation would hurt the Democratic Party at the polls. All the usual preaching and attacks on anyone who dared question the "climate catastrophe" narrative and its result.

"Continuing to wish for cheap gas prices in order to win ignorant voters. Isn’t this a wonderful country?"

"People have options these days. Go electric. Stop making yourself a victim of big oil. Its not the 70s anymore despite what the propagandists tell you."

"Our gas prices are actually low compared with the rest of the world. What's really hurting us is the propaganda from hate radio and corporate owned TV."

----

Finally some "stupid and ignorant out of touch climate change denying traitor and deplorable" chimes in with this.

"Only the ignorant live paycheck to paycheck? I want cheap gas and groceries so my fucking family can eat. Then take the remaining and save up for that electric car I’m already supposed to have. Check your fucking privilege."

I know what side of the debate I'm on TBF. Strongly with the latter. Thanks for listening. Just throwing this out there. I'll ramble about the "woke issues" next. lol





Recommendations

2 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

I agree. Lunabell Jan 2025 #1
Will our big donors allow this? jalan48 Jan 2025 #2
That's our problem - TBF Jan 2025 #5
Mostly they don't Bettie Jan 2025 #65
Given Sanders didn't win the primary, would the voters allow it seems more important EdmondDantes_ Jan 2025 #8
Sounds like you're a no on adopting Bernie's ideas moving forward. jalan48 Jan 2025 #9
I think who wins the primaries has depended a lot TBF Jan 2025 #18
This is a critical point... DEMS had more billionaires in their corner in 2024 than the GOP. WarGamer Jan 2025 #17
If our goal is to please billionaires, we will never be the party for the working class. nt TBF Jan 2025 #19
x1000 nt WarGamer Jan 2025 #20
This message was self-deleted by its author LiberalArkie Jan 2025 #32
Yes this is exactly the starting point LearnedHand Jan 2025 #3
Exactly Emile Jan 2025 #4
To remind us all of the elements in the Sanders platform, I'm posting a link below from 2019. Lonestarblue Jan 2025 #6
Thank you for this LearnedHand Jan 2025 #12
u know a lot of ppl blame bernie for us ending up here, right? mopinko Jan 2025 #7
"start with a platform" Cirsium Jan 2025 #13
the op named sanders. mopinko Jan 2025 #22
Right Cirsium Jan 2025 #23
bad branding. mopinko Jan 2025 #24
Branding doesn't matter Cirsium Jan 2025 #35
yes, branding does matter. mopinko Jan 2025 #41
Branding Cirsium Jan 2025 #44
bernie's politics r fine w me. mopinko Jan 2025 #45
Good Cirsium Jan 2025 #48
Of course there's "hate out there" - oligarchs do not want to share TBF Jan 2025 #15
fully fund and expand the aca. that was in place. mopinko Jan 2025 #21
Medicare is in place - TBF Jan 2025 #28
well, you're doing quite a bit of conflating there. but the aca exists, too. and it's better. mopinko Jan 2025 #30
OK, start with ACA then - TBF Jan 2025 #33
Forgive the intrusion. Hope you don't mind. Sailingfish Jan 2025 #49
Fantastic food for thought TBF Jan 2025 #50
What? Cirsium Jan 2025 #46
This is the answer. Voltaire2 Jan 2025 #10
Can you point out one neoliberalism policy of the Biden administration? Self Esteem Jan 2025 #27
Any policy I don't like is neo-liberal. comradebillyboy Jan 2025 #38
Exactly right. Biden might be the first non-neoliberal president we've had since LBJ. Self Esteem Jan 2025 #51
Both Sides insult that Ds have same policies as Rs: deregulation, privatization, austerity, and a stupid betsuni Jan 2025 #60
Well. I'm not a Bernie fan whatsoever, BUT ismnotwasm Jan 2025 #11
I only mentioned Bernie because he is someone who is further left that we all know - TBF Jan 2025 #16
When Tim Walz was picked by Kamala Harris I was ecstatic. She made a fabulous choice and the buzz was Nanjeanne Jan 2025 #14
i ve been left most of my adult life , with out us lefties ( no joke here ) we wouldnt be here what we are today AllaN01Bear Jan 2025 #25
The majority of Americans consistantly agree... Think. Again. Jan 2025 #26
Absolutely - the oligarchs spend a lot of money developing wedge issues TBF Jan 2025 #29
But they don't vote that way. comradebillyboy Jan 2025 #36
Correct, the current Democratic Party hasn't won them over. Think. Again. Jan 2025 #37
Call me when Bernie can win a Democratic primary. comradebillyboy Jan 2025 #39
I don't think this OP is suggesting running Bernie. Think. Again. Jan 2025 #40
Heavens no, I adore him but he has other roles now. One is making platforms - TBF Jan 2025 #42
Part of the problem is that you want to immediately label TBF Jan 2025 #43
A big part of Bernie's appeal is that he's not a Democrat, or at least not "Establishment." DickKessler Jan 2025 #31
A thoughtful post - thank you. TBF Jan 2025 #34
What is the purpose of this section? Cirsium Jan 2025 #47
Yes, that will be part of pushing forward I suppose. TBF Jan 2025 #53
since Bernie's plan has never really been implemented, it still is a new way forward for a party that has really NewHendoLib Jan 2025 #54
I agree Cirsium Jan 2025 #56
Why are the only 2 options qazplm135 Jan 2025 #52
I could argue TBF Jan 2025 #55
My point is qazplm135 Jan 2025 #57
That is what we've been doing for years & it isn't working imo. nt TBF Jan 2025 #61
Well that's the challenge qazplm135 Jan 2025 #62
It needs to happen behind the scenes -- TBF Jan 2025 #63
The right does it qazplm135 Jan 2025 #64
What really is "far left"? The kinds of policies that every other civilized industrial nation seems to have like Nanjeanne Jan 2025 #58
It doesn't matter if you or I qazplm135 Jan 2025 #59
Popular for quite awhile, and that is just one policy among many we should be champions for: Passages Jan 2025 #66
Agree with every point, well said msfiddlestix Jan 2025 #67
Honestly I haven't a clue - I have been building my base at Bluesky TBF Jan 2025 #68
As much as I have always admired her, that simply isn't enough.. but it's not nothing. msfiddlestix Jan 2025 #69
You're reacting appropriately to your environment TBF Jan 2025 #70
Latest Discussions»The Way Forward»So much to do, but first ...»Reply #49